Ryan Kimler is the Founder of Financial Clarity, working with solo and partner practice law firms, bringing them financial clarity to grow their law practice into successful and profitable businesses. In this episode, Ryan talks about how important financial discipline and accounting is for a law firm and how invaluable the guidance of a CFO or accountant can be on that regard.
They also discuss how the CFO and accountant is not only useful for keeping your law firm financially uncompromised, but also to project future earnings and actions that must be taken to ensure the firm's profit for each of its members.
Timestamps:
“Accounting and finance doesn’t have to be the scary part of your firm… we want to be your guide, help you out, give you a clear direction and clean financials and bring clarity around the numbers of your law firm” - Ryan Kimler
Ryan Kimler, Financial Clarity
Website: https://www.financialclarityllc.com/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryankfinancialclarityllc/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/rkimler
Blog: https://financialclarityllc.blogspot.com/
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiLyqCOvxvnnlr3_6BOGqww
Ryan Kimler, Founder of Financial Clarity
CFO and Accounting for Law Firms
Ryan Kimler is an Accountant and CFO. His passion is in helping attorneys run their law firm by the numbers to increase profitability and cash flow. He helps attorneys spend more time working on their business instead of in their business so that lawyers can get back to crushing their business instead of the other way around.
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryankfinancialclarityllc/
Have comments, questions, or concerns? Contact us at feedback@1958lawyer.com
Episode Transcript:
Ron Bockstahler 0:28
Welcome to the 1958 lawyer. I'm your host Ron box dollar. Today we are joined by CFO Ryan Kindler, founder of financial clarity. Ryan's firm works with solo and partner practice law firms, bringing them financial clarity to grow their law practice into successful and profitable business is something that we all want. Ryan, welcome to the show.
Ryan Kimler 0:47
Thanks a lot, Ron. It's great to be here today.
Ron Bockstahler 0:49
Absolutely. Let's get right down to it. I mean, why is the law firm need a CFO?
Ryan Kimler 0:54
That's a great question. So a lot of people, you know, they hear the term CFO, and the first thing that they think of is probably Google, or Apple, right, some large company. And then I think I don't need a CFO, I'm just a small business owner, right? However, a CFOs job is really to track profit, and cash flow, and then go analyze the company's financial strengths and weaknesses, and process what the corrective actions should be. So even, you know, small businesses, you know, in order for them to continue to grow and be more profitable, they need a CFO, they need someone in their corner that can analyze the numbers, look at the financial strengths and weaknesses and propose corrective actions.
Ron Bockstahler 1:37
It's interesting. I remember when PPP first came out back in was at April of 2020. And we did a live webinar on it trying to introduce a lot of our law firms to you can go get people, you're qualified, right, you qualify for PPP. But you have to have done last year's taxes. Yeah. And I was shocked at how many like, man, I'd like this is great, but I can't apply because I haven't even filed my 2019 taxes. Yeah, 2018? I think I was it was going back. And I was surprised with what I considered the financial, lack of financial discipline, it's so many firms. How can we change that what kind of process can be put in place? Let's say I'm a brand new attorney gonna go off on my own. Maybe I only have $500,000 book a business to start with. So it's not big, but yeah, potentially can grow? What do I need? How do I get started?
Ryan Kimler 2:31
Yeah, absolutely. So you know, the big thing that, you know, we bring up to our clients when we're working with them is, you know, we, we really want to be their guide. And, you know, help them understand that accounting, and finance doesn't have to be the scary part of your firm, right? It doesn't have to be the unknown part that is like, I don't want to go talk to my accountant, right? You know, we want to be your guide we want, we want to be your friend, we want to help you out, we want to give you a clear direction and clean financials and bring you clarity around the numbers of your law firm. And I think that's what every firm needs. You know, one of the big things that's changed over the last five years is, you know, with technology and zoom and things like that, and we've advanced so far because of the pandemic, you know, attorneys, you can go out now and find accountants and CFOs that specialize in working with law firms, as our firm does. And you don't have to just go to the generalized accounting firm or the generalized bookkeeper down the street that handles everybody's small business and town. That's kind of a catch 22 because they aren't specialized. And so they don't necessarily know all the ins and outs of a law firm and how to help you. And as an owner, of a law firm, you don't necessarily know what's out there and what's available of how much help you can really get from a financial partner that can work with you that specializes in law firms, and has been exposed to lots of different law firms and lots of different systems.
Ron Bockstahler 3:59
Ryan, let's talk a little bit the financial model. I think a lot of firms say I'm a to partner law firm, and we're ready to hire someone. Yeah, put some numbers behind it. What's it mean to hire somebody? I mean, do they? I mean, can you help them? financially justify the higher I guess is the question.
Ryan Kimler 4:17
Yeah, absolutely. So the, you know, a lot of our clients we put on profit first, which if you're not familiar, it's basically a way of dividing your income that comes into the firm into a few different buckets. So you can cover your owner payments, your taxes and your operating expenses. And so one of the first things that we look at is, you know, what's it going to cost to hire this person. And for that, we use a couple different online tools to calculate like payroll taxes and estimated benefit costs and things like that. Do you have the money that's been allocated into your operating expense bucket to go out and hire that person, because if you don't have the money, you can't hire the person, right? And then you just, you're just going to be shorting yourself profit and cash flow in the future. So that's one of the First things that we look at and then one of the second things we look at is okay, let's say you do have the money, and you do have enough in your operating expenses with paying all your other bills paying everything else. What can you expect that person to bring in and get, you know, as far as an handle as far as a caseload so that hiring that person is not just a cost, but it actually is, brings value to your firm, and you're bringing in more money. So those are the big two things that we start with and look at the first one being, can you even afford it?
Ron Bockstahler 5:32
Right? Are you familiar with it? Or I guess I know you're familiar with it. But let's talk to the third, third, third, if you're a large law firm, or accounting firm, I think they have real similar models, you're going to hire a an associate, I think even a partner you'd look at, okay, your salary is going to be a third overheads going to be a third, which is their benefits, office space, whatever it takes to employ them. And then a third is profits. Yep. So I think too many firms Don't think like that, or small firms Don't think like that. They just, Oh, I got a lot of work, I'm gonna go hire someone, but say I bring someone in for $100,000. Are they going to generate $300,000? in revenue?
Ryan Kimler 6:07
Right? Yeah, that's, that's tough. And yeah, and I think a lot of attorneys, you know, don't look at that right away. And that's probably one of the first things that they should be looking at. And, you know, I, we have definitely come into firms where, you know, we put them into a profit first system, and unfortunately, you know, we kind of figure out through some analysis that they've hired too quickly. And then they have to go have the unfortunate conversation of letting someone go, I mean, that's tough. But like you said, you know, using the third, third, third rule, looking in advance, before you ever hire that person is really, you know, is doing your due diligence is really what should happen.
Ron Bockstahler 6:47
But we deal with that on the staffing side, they go hire a paralegal, but they don't got enough work, you know, fulfill the third, third, third model, which means they're giving up their profits. Yeah, it's interesting. Let's talk a little bit about banks. I know we chatted offline just a little bit. You know, I know I've gone to banks, and I've gone to investors and other businesses, and it's, you got to have someone in your corner. Yeah. How do you help law firms either go secure financing, I guess, what's the question?
Ryan Kimler 7:15
So the first thing is, is that any bank you go to, as far as going to get funding, you're going to have clean books, you're gonna have to have, you know, all of your expenses updated, and all of your, you know, up to date financial statements. So that's the first thing that CFOs can help with, as well, as you know, then once you have those financial statements, your CFO is going to know those financial statements and know what's going on, know how cash flows through your business. And having a CFO or a financial professional in your corner, when you go to a bank to go get funding is really, you know, giving you a leg up, it's a big advantage brings a lot of credibility to the table. And as being a financial person, they're going to be able to look at how cash flows through your business and kind of assess before you even get to a bank, how much risk is there? How much you know, how much risk tolerance is there? And then they can have that conversation at the bank of how much risk are they willing to take on? And also kind of advise you, as far as you know, maybe you don't have as much risk as what the bank thinks that you have? And where to go from there. You know, what, you know, is the interest rate, really reasonable for the amount of risk is there right, you kind of get your own second opinion from a person that you trust, and that's on your side, that's not sitting across the table from you.
Ron Bockstahler 8:31
So you know, law firms, a service industry, so looking at historical data is I wouldn't say useless, but you're kind of on the assumption that you can repeat that, that level of business. So how is it beneficial for to have a law firm when they're going in to get maybe a line of credit established to have forecast based on historical revenues?
Ryan Kimler 8:49
Yes, absolutely. And I would say not only having a forecast, but also a plan put together of, you know, let's say you project revenue growth, revenue increase, what's your plan to get there, you know, how many cases that how many average case value dollars, and that's something that a CFO can definitely put together for you that we do on a monthly basis with our clients is, you know, updating what their, what their targets are, what their projection is, and then, you know, keeping track of those numbers of how they're doing on a scoreboard so that they can see it and know where they're at. Rather, they're meeting what they want their target To be or not. It's almost like
Ron Bockstahler 9:26
playing a game of baseball, you're looking at scorecard, you say, Hey, where am I? You know, it's coming into the seventh thing. You need to score some runs here.
Ryan Kimler 9:32
Absolutely, absolutely. That's exactly what it's like. And it really gives the firm owner an idea of what's working in the business, what's not working, and rather not they're on pace and on track to meet their target. That's actually probably one of the biggest problems that we are challenges that we run into working with firms is that they don't have a scoreboard they don't know where they're at. They don't know if they're winning or losing the game. You know, they're just kind of running their firm. And if they don't make enough money at the end of the month, then they just start working harder and harder and harder. And they're firm without kind of digging in and finding out what's going on.
Ron Bockstahler 10:10
You know why you're not making the money? Where's your dress? Yeah, that kind of leads me into, you know, what, many lawyers are frustrated by that financial aspect of running a law firm? How can you get help get them past the frustration, so they can focus on practicing law?
Ryan Kimler 10:23
Yeah, absolutely. So I think a lot of it comes with, you know, taking the majority of the work off their plate. So, you know, we've we've developed a system that, you know, really what I did was I sat down and, you know, I've worked with a little over 200 law firms, I sat down looked at, okay, what's the operations as far as on the financial side, when it comes to accounting, and their CFO work, you know, what has to happen? In order for us to get clear reports and develop a scoreboard? And, you know, I developed? You know, what parts? Can the accountant take off? have lawyers play? What parts does the lawyer absolutely have to do? And then if they have an assistant, what parts can the assistant take, and, you know, through that process, you know, we really came down to an attorney needs to do their billing, um, you know, ideally through some sort of CRM, and an attorney needs to pay bills that they're paying personally, if they don't want an assistant, you know, handling it, or what or what have you, but eliminating a lot of the other tasks, and getting, you know, the attorney out of, you know, those other time sucks, if you will, can really help them, you know, focus back on practicing law. And then also, you know, at the end of the month, you know, simple one hour meeting with your accountant or CFO to give you an update and look at your scoreboard and know where you're at and give you a clear heading for the next month and the quarter coming up can really be efficient for the attorney and get them back into practicing law, when they have a clear direction and a clear path moving
Ron Bockstahler 11:57
forward. It just hearing you say it, thanks. I think about how much stress, you could take off an attorney's plate. Just on an average day, you know, you don't have to worry about this, you know where you're going now he's gonna focus on where you're gonna get your business from. Yeah, is much easier. Absolutely. I like that. What are you seeing as some of the biggest mistakes out there that's happening within law firms.
Ryan Kimler 12:18
So one of the biggest one I one of the biggest ones, I think, from from a cash flow perspective, is not taking in trust funds. So you know, the, the big thing in law school is, you know, don't, don't screw up your trust account, right. And don't overdraw it, right. And you'll get audited, and all these all these scare tactics, all these things. And, you know, even if you're doing contingency cases, right, I know that the common thing and that contingency space is what we do it, you know, basically up front for free. And when we when we take, you know, 1/3 of the fee, or whatever your percentages, right, and they're not taking a trust fund up front. The big problem with that is, is that when you go to the courthouse, and you pay a filing fee, or you go do whatever expense the case needs, you're taking cash that you've earned, you know, into your business, probably from other cases, and you're paying it out. And it's not getting billed, sometimes for months, right, because you know, if your case lasts for months, and so it's cash that you've earned, that you could be using in your own firm, to pay your own expenses, rent, you know, employees, what have you, and instead, you're paying it out on a client case. Now granted, it gets booked as an asset, right? It's almost like, it's almost like you're giving your client a short term loan, it's almost like you're being a bank. And actually, you know, quick tip, I guess a good check on your accountant, if they know what they're doing or not, is they should have an account on your balance sheet in the asset section that says, like advanced client costs or client costs, that you expect it back, you by IRS guidelines, you cannot expense those items. So therefore, it's not writing down your taxable income. And that's really the reason for it is the IRS wants their money. You know, so just think so paying that cash out, you know, is really not helping you, it's not helping you write down your income, reduce taxes, you know, it really should be your clients cost. And even if it's a contingency case, and you can collect 500 bucks on a retainer, right, I mean, or whatever it is not having to pay that out of your firm and acting like a bank, keeps more cash in your bank in your firm. And is really a big mistake that I've commonly see, when I work with firms that the do contingency work or even not doing tend to see work and just don't collect enough trust funds.
Ron Bockstahler 14:40
Real quick, and though so you take money out of your post tax income, and you pay a fee for a case that's a cut down on contingency. You can't charge interest on that to the client. Correct?
Ryan Kimler 14:52
Correct. You cannot.
Ron Bockstahler 14:53
So this is interesting. I was listening to someone Esquire bank was talking with Len Lerner who is a big Personal Injury Attorney out of Vegas. And so Glen for years was finding basically financing his own cases and realized how crazy it was because he was losing money. Whereas you know, he can, he works with Esquire bank, and he goes back and just give me they finance a case. And that's how he's paying those fees, and then is able to charge the client, those fees plus whatever interest, you know that he had to pay the bank?
Ryan Kimler 15:25
Sure. So yeah, that's much better than paying it out yourself.
Ron Bockstahler 15:29
That's a great point to bring up that I think so many attorneys are just missing. And they think, well, I got the cash, I'm just gonna do it, which is kind of probably what I would do it, you know, without being educated and understanding it. So this is a good reason that you need to be working with a CFO is going to save you money. And what happens when something goes wrong with the case, you just take a loss?
Ryan Kimler 15:45
Yeah, absolutely. If if you if you take a contingency case, and let's say you have a bunch of filing fees, let's say it adds up to $500. And you do lose the case, and then at that point, you do not expect your client to pay you. At that point, what happens is, then that does become an expense for your law firm, which means it does write down your taxes. However, obviously, you are out the cash. And you know, it's already it's already flowed out of your firm.
Ron Bockstahler 16:13
So now you just lost money taking the case. Yeah, you mentioned iolta accounts, let's talk about iolta accounts, and what are some of the do's and don'ts in managing an account?
Ryan Kimler 16:22
Sure, absolutely. So one of the things that I've learned is, do not make sure that your credit card company is not taking credit card fees out of the trust account. If they are that something that has to be replaced and becomes a real headache. But a lot of merchant companies do like to do that. So that's, that's a pain. I like working with law pay, because they don't, they only take fees out of your operating account, never out of your trust account. Another another don't is there are several big cities that are on state borders. So like Kansas City, right? If you're in Kansas City, Missouri, you know, you might have worked in Kansas, you might have worked in Missouri, you do have to have if you're operating in both states, you do have to have two separate trust accounts. And you need to keep those funds separated. You know, Kansas City is not the only one, like Philadelphia would be another example. Right, Pennsylvania and New Jersey, keep those trust accounts separated and you cannot commingle funds. So that is those are, those are two of a couple of the most common mistakes. And then a third one, when I would say would be I don't, I don't like to see attorneys write checks out of their trust account. Because a lot of times they'll go to the courthouse, they'll write a check for a fee, it'll come out of their trust account. And then before they get back to the courthouse, they do or sorry, their office from the courthouse, they do go into a million other things, and then they forget that they wrote that check, it doesn't get into the ledger. And before you know it, you know, you've shorted a client ledger in your trust account, because you kept you know, taking fees on down the road. So I don't like to see attorneys write checks if they can avoid it. Or if you're going to write checks, really what I like to see is I like to see attorneys print checks from their office, you know, have your assistant do it or whatever, and take them to the courthouse with you. I know it's tough, because you don't always know the fees that you're gonna need. But that's what I like to see happen. And then another Another common mistake is run just running all revenue through the trust account. That is not that is absolutely not a best practice. But I know some attorneys, you know, they they just tell there's this anytime you're collecting a payment, you know, just run it through the trust account. Right? And then they go through and they sort out what's earned and what's not, or that is absolutely not a best practice. I do not like to see that. I mean, really what it comes down to is you just need to educate your assistant, or tell them, you know, this is trust or no, this is not trust. But that's a that's a common mistake that I see. And yeah, you're basically just you're bringing in revenue through the trust account, and then just moving it all the time over to the operating.
Ron Bockstahler 18:59
It sounds like it's more of a it can be a real management headache. So what can you What can a law firm? What can an attorney do to reduce the time spent on trying to manage these accounts? Yeah, so
Ryan Kimler 19:09
clear operating procedures are very important. You know, a lot of times I like to see my attorneys collect a trust retainer at the beginning, that they feel is going to support the case one time, and then as they do their Billings, they can just transfer out of the trust account and transfer the Earned funds. And then they don't have to deal with additional payments. Another great management tool is just having some sort of CRM, right online that that everybody in your office can access at any given time and see the trust balances, right. You don't have to share all the revenues with with everybody in your office, but at least let them see trust balances so that they know who's whose ledger has money who's doesn't and you know, it saves them and it's all in one system so that you don't have attorneys that are keeping Separate Ledger's on paper in their own office, and it's not getting in all into one system that is, that is the biggest, most important thing that I've seen over the years is just get it all into one system that everybody can access and be in the know, and keep the system up to date. You know, if it's a daily entry, you have to make keep it up to date. And from there, things run pretty smoothly,
Ron Bockstahler 20:24
you're getting systems you're recommending.
Ryan Kimler 20:27
So I am a certified advisor with Clio. However, you know, that's not the only one. I mean, there's there are a lot of systems out there, I've worked with practice Panther as well. My case, case, Fox, there's you know, there's a lot of systems out there, they really all cover their basis. But I do like Clio quite a bit. It really has helped keep a lot of attorneys that we've worked with from overdrawn that trust account, because they can go and pull that ledger up really quickly on their own. Alright, well, let's stand
Ron Bockstahler 20:58
the software topic, there are a couple tips that you can share that will improve profitability quickly.
Ryan Kimler 21:04
Sure. So I did mention lawpay a little bit earlier, right? Everybody, everybody's in the game now of collecting credit card fees, right. And that's how we collect payments from a lot of our customers, I actually encourage the law firms that I work with to change the expectation right up front, and if you can collect at ages, right. So with law pay right now, their lowest credit card fee is 1.95%. plus an additional 20 cents per transaction versus a flat a CH is $2. So let's say you're taking in a $1,000 retainer run in the credit card route, you're paying at least 19, almost $20 a CH route $2. Right. And a lot of times, I think it's just the expectation that the assistant or someone at the front desk sets up front and says, Okay, well, we'll take your credit card to pay for this, which well, instead, you know, if you say we collect pay him a CH because a lot of times what I think their clients probably do is okay, here's my credit card, they put on the credit card, and then a month later their statement comes out and they get the bill and they take the money out of their bank account, and they go pay their credit card bill. So they had the money right in the in their bank account. And taking the a CH you know, keeps the fees down and, you know, $20 versus 218 dollars times all of your transactions, if you you know, as many as you can get transferred over, those savings can really add up. So that's one thing that I like to do. And actually, right now all of our clients that are farmer is on a CH,
Ron Bockstahler 22:35
that's a great point. And we're seeing it anywhere, I donated money recently. And you know, they say you're paying the 3.95%, you know fee if you're paying a credit card. So it's just become a part of everywhere. So I don't think an attorney shouldn't be hesitant to say, we accept a car. But if we're going to accept credit card, you're going to charge the fee processor.
Ryan Kimler 22:54
Absolutely, that's another way to do it. And I would encourage attorneys to check their fees, too, I know that there are some payment processes out there that are pretty expensive. Law pay is one of the cheapest that I found, you know, saving, let's just say 1% on all your credit cards, well, you know, figure out what you're figuring out what your credit card revenue was for last year, that can really that can really add up to some big money. Another another tip that I would get into as far as software's go. attorneys are a lot like accountants, we see this flashy new software that we think oh my gosh, this is the perfect fit into what I need. This is you know, this is this is going to be so great for my firm, you go and you sign up for it, you give them a credit card, you start a 14 day free trial, you know, sometimes you use the software for a month, sometimes you don't use the software at all. And then they just start charging your credit card and month after month after month, you get hit with it, you know, it's the common subscription model. It's very common in the marketplace nowadays. And so I like to that's one of the things that we do is we like to review your recurring charges once a quarter, you know, recently I sat down and did that with an attorney, we took 4045 minutes, this was the first time that I had done this with this client. And we ended up saving him for $189 a month of just subscriptions that he had signed up for over time, and just was not using. So that's almost six grand a year from 45 minutes of effort. So that's a that's a great exercise that I really like to run through. And if you if you want to do it the the easy kind of a pain in the butt way it'd be to just go get a new credit card and cancel your old one. And all these you're going to get all these notifications to your email box of Hey, your credit card failed your credit card failed, your credit card failed. And then you can go through your emails and look Do I really need this Do I really not. So that's another way to do that as well. It's kind of a pain in the butt. But that's another way to do that as well.
Ron Bockstahler 24:54
Yeah, but you really can uncover what you're spending most of us. I don't I mean, I don't have any idea.
Ryan Kimler 25:00
Yeah, that's really important. You know, it can really, really add up over time. And, you know, I think, you know, the 50 $500 or $6,000 that we saved over him over the next year, for 40 or 45 minutes of his time, I think is pretty well worth it.
Ron Bockstahler 25:18
So that mean, that's quarter million dollars over a 40 year law firm career?
Ryan Kimler 25:22
Yeah. Over over 40 minutes of work?
Ron Bockstahler 25:25
Yeah. You know, look, you got it. I know, you put a lot of stuff out there, you do a lot of writing, you're published in quite a few areas, do you have anything that's coming up any events that people can tune into to hear more?
Ryan Kimler 25:36
We do. So Thursday, October 14, we are going to be having a webinar around financial education. And I'm really excited about that webinar. I also have a really special giveaway for all the webinar attendees that are going to show up. So definitely look for that. Yeah. And
Ron Bockstahler 25:57
what's uh, I got a couple more questions. But where can attorneys reach out? And where can they reach you online?
Ryan Kimler 26:02
Sure, absolutely. So www dot financial clarity, LLC. com is my home web page, I have a contact page on there, you can book a call with me. And then also, I'm on LinkedIn as well, you can look up Ryan Kilmer on LinkedIn. And actually, Ron, you and I are connected. So anybody as long as you're connected with Ron, I should show up as a second contact or a second second degree connection, I guess is what they call it.
Ron Bockstahler 26:27
You know, I'll tell listeners, I've listened I've read a lot of the content you've put out. It's been awesome. So I think you've really got some great stuff out there. You know what you're talking about, I think you can help a lot of the the solo partner practice law firms out there that they don't really want to deal with it. But it's one thing to make money which you can not spend it also, it's kind of a combination. That works. For some people, the PnL has a profit and profits and expenses, you got to pay attention to both? Yeah, absolutely. I get to get to the end product. So. So Ryan, real quick, is there anything else you want to add that you want to go over that I haven't asked questions on,
Ryan Kimler 27:00
I think we've done a really good job of covering, you know, quite a bit of the the big topics and challenges that law firm owners deal with, I guess the, the biggest thing is, you know, I just I guess I would want your listeners to know that, you know, I think I said this a little bit in the beginning. But accounting and finance doesn't have to be the hard, scary, unknown part of your firm. You know, I know that it's not, it's not necessarily a lawyers expertise, just like my expertise is not practicing law, you know, but you get with the right guide, get with the right person at the right firm. And it can really change how you view that section of your business and really give you power and managing that part of your business. And it can bring real change to your law firm. And profitability and cash flow. Both are super, super important. You know, you can't operate a day in business without cash. So, so yeah, I guess that's, I guess that's the biggest thing that I'd want your listeners to know, it doesn't have to be hard. And there's there are professionals out there that specialize in working with law firms. And, you know, they're easier to find now in the zoom world that we live in. And, you know, there are people out there that can help.
Ron Bockstahler 28:12
So it's coming from us a partial CFO serving over 200 law firms. And so from your perspective, what's one thing in the legal profession that you would like to see change?
Ryan Kimler 28:23
I would say one thing that I'd like to see changed, I would say, our court system, like I would really love to see our court system change. You know, it's such a tough one, you know, it, you know, these jury trials, you know, made up of your friends and peers, right, for criminal trials. I mean, they just don't, they just don't always work. You know, so that's a problem. You know, I think the time that it takes to get through a case can be a problem. Our, our court system is definitely an imperfect system. I'm sure that you know, attorneys have even more frustration with it than I do. But, you know, it's, as far as the legal side goes, I mean, that's something that I would like to see change, you know, we've got to we've got to get together and figure out something better, as far as, you know, for the lawyers for the people. You know, I know that being a lawyer is high stress job, right? I mean, you're, you're trying to go and win cases not just for your clients, but also for you know, the families of the clients that you're working for, you got a lot of people that are depending on you. And I think you know, a lot of times you work really, really really hard in your law firm and self care is not always at the top of the list. You know, I can definitely relate when, when tax season rolls around and and our clients are demanding a lot from us, you know, self care and family time is not always at the top of the list. And that's something that I would that I want to see changed. You know, I want to help the law firms that we work with, make a strong profit and a strong cash flow and have the time that they want that for themselves, and for their families to live their life, that's something that, absolutely, you know, I'm out to check cause changing.
Ron Bockstahler 30:10
While you're talking about one question came up that I'm sure most of you probably already know the answer, but I don't. So I'm gonna ask the question in pro bono work. Is there any kind of tax relief for pro bono work?
Ryan Kimler 30:20
Yes. So if you if you build the case, as as you normally would, right? So these are like, you know, let's say your hourly rates $200 an hour, right? I'm just throwing out numbers, but you build a case you build the hours, right, that value, whatever it comes out to be, let's just say it's five grand right? can really be put on as donated time, right? When it comes to doing your tax return and things like that, that should be able to be expensed.
Ron Bockstahler 30:50
Okay, so there's good benefit to doing some pro bono work. So if you can free up time by hiring a CFO, do some pro bono work and lower your tax burden. There you go. Awesome. Ryan. It was great having you on the on the show today. Let's repeat one more time best way for our listeners to contact you.
Ryan Kimler 31:06
www dot financial clarity LLC comm or you can find me on LinkedIn. Ryan killer.
Ron Bockstahler 31:13
Ryan, thanks for joining the show today. And thank you for listening to the 1958 lawyer podcast. If you like the show, please share it with other attorneys. And if you would like to be a guest on the 1958 lawyer shoot me a message at Ron V at a badass is calm. And let's talk until next time. Have a great weekend.
Ryan Kimler 31:29
Thank you very much for having me today, Ron.
Ron Bockstahler 31:31
Absolutely.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai